father didn’t want to continue his legacy because they knew that becoming a pastor was a difficult job. As a pastor, you needed to live a life of poverty, sacrifice, and selflessness. I’ve heard from my uncles about how difficult their lives were. When my grandfather was martyred, my family had no money. They had to walk 10 miles to go to school, and they didn’t grow up with decent meals. That’s why nobody wanted to become a pastor. Despite all that, my grandmother always wanted one of her grandchildren to become a pastor and [carry on] her husband’s legacy.

I always remembered [my grandfather] and never wanted to become a pastor because I had the kind of attitude where I wanted to be rich and famous. I wanted to live in a good house and drive a nice car. I thought that maybe in the future, I could become a business owner and become a jangnonim (장로님 — church elder) who was rich and could donate a lot to the church. I wanted to become somebody like that.

When I became a fervent Christian at the end of ninth grade, I had a dream, which I still remember vividly. A crazy fire came down from the sky and burned everything on the surface of the earth. I knew that it was an unusual dream and that it was probably a God-given dream.

I remember I went to a prayer mountain for a retreat with my church. While I was praying, a pastor I didn’t know approached me. I still don’t know who he is. He just walked up to me and said, ‘Did you have this kind of dream?’ Then he described exactly what I dreamed about. I was like, “How did you know? I don’t even know you.”

He told me, ‘God gave you that dream. That means that one day God will use you. So get ready.’ Before this incident, my name was Charles.* The pastor told me to change my name to P. Joe. That’s why I am P. Joe. All my high school and junior high school friends know me as Charles. When I became a U.S. citizen, I changed my name because of the pastor I met at the prayer mountain.

I went on a short-term mission trip to Kenya in the summer of 2009. I realized that there were so many churches in Nairobi because that is where there is money and decent living. But there were no churches outside the capital. There was no water, no hospitals, no anything. There were so many churches within the center of the city, but then there were no pastors, no churches, no electricity, no order, outside of it.

I complained to God about the unfairness of the situation. “These people are called by you. They don’t obey you, but they live comfortably in the capital. There are so many potential believers outside the capital who have nothing. What’s going on?” And then God spoke to me. That’s you, he said. You want a comfortable life, just like the citizens in Nairobi do. You’ve been running away from my calling. That’s when my heart was convinced.

And so I came back. My grandmother passed away that year. Her last words to me went something like this: ‘I’ve always been praying for you, and I wish that you would become a pastor and continue the legacy of your grandfather.’ I told her that I was too unclean. That I loved secular stuff. I wanted to be rich, and I enjoyed earthly life. But she said to me, ‘God can use anything. He can use you.’ Her favorite gospel song was “Use Me” by Ron Kenoley. The lyrics go like this: “Take my hands and my feet. Touch my heart and speak to me.” I held that in my heart.

When she passed away, I applied to seminary school. I thought that if I got accepted, I would become a pastor. I started my journey to become a pastor extremely late. I was 30 or 31. I didn’t do a good job on my application. I was a little bit off from the deadline. To be honest, I didn’t care about my faith statement or the reason why I wanted to go to college. I prayed to God, thinking that if they still accepted me, I’d become a pastor. If not, I would continue on with my life. Amazingly enough, the seminary school accepted me, and at that moment, I closed my business and went to seminary. 

Korean Pastors are often regarded as the “therapists” of the community, as many church members come to them with a plethora of issues. Can you describe your role in Koreatown?

I used to provide spiritual mentoring and counseling to many Koreans in Koreatown. I could comfort a lot of youth and adults in a spiritual way,  but they weren’t really getting out of their vicious cycles of abuse and addiction. Churches can do a lot spiritually, especially since they focus on inner peace and eternal life.

I helped most of these people through the church. Word got around about my reputation and how I helped my youth ministry kids spiritually and mentally, and encouraged them to come to church and believe in Christ. Their parents and their friends began to talk about me as the pastor who really cares, and the people who heard the rumors came to me. I couldn’t help them all, but I did my best. I was also sending lots of kids to good colleges, and Korean parents were extremely interested in that. 

I wanted to help people on both a physical and mental plane. I thought to myself, what can I do to bring restoration to the physical body and psychological restoration to families? For this reason, I’ve been doing a lot of conferences. That’s why I was involved with KYCC, specifically their Clinical Services KISM (Korean Integrated Service Management). Until the beginning of this year, I was an outreach officer at KYCC, helping people at various levels.

What experience in your life — as a pastor, a spiritual mentor, a teacher, etc. — stood out to you the most?

There was a school principal who was physically abusing one of her students, who was an eighth grader at the time. The child’s mother could not report the woman to the authorities because they were [undocumented immigrants]. They were threatened, but they couldn’t receive justice. The boy’s friend’s mother heard about me from someone else and set up an appointment to meet through the church.

I helped them. I listened to their problems and also gave them psychological and spiritual comfort. I was there for them in times of anxiety and panic. But the work that I was doing was not fundamentally treating the issues of illegal immigrants involved in abuse. I truly believe in justice. I wanted to bring this afterschool principal to court.

I got help from another institution and KYCC to tackle this issue. I learned that if a person is involved in a situation of assault or abuse, they are protected by the government. They had the opportunity to get a V Visa, which gives the victim legal residency and protection until the problem is resolved. 

The mother and the son were able to receive a green card because they were involved with this kind of issue. I didn’t know about those things because I’m not a legal expert; I’m not well-read on immigration laws. Because I was affiliated with many different institutions, including KYCC, I was able to tackle the fundamental issue.

How have you been involved with KYCC?

I was connected with school counselors. One of the counselors I worked with was Esther,* who was a school counselor at a high school in Koreatown. She used to be one of my Bible study group leaders. She knew that I was very involved with conferences and youth counseling. Esther, [a couple of others], and I were all interested in doing joint programs for the Koreatown youth.

We gathered together and had a meeting. There, I met Eric Ji and learned about KYCC, more specifically, the KISM program. At the time, KYCC needed somebody who could connect KYCC and KISM with local churches. That’s how I naturally got involved with the program.